Plans for Dish Network Eastern Arc Trav'ler?

[ShapeShifter]

I hear from the rumor mill that Dish Network is migrating 16 more markets (including mine) to their Eastern Arc (61.5, 27.2, 77) constellation. This increases the number of people who will be using the newer style 1000.4 dish. This should also increase the number of people who will want a 1000.4 compatible rooftop Trav'ler dish on their RV (like me! )

Now that there will be an increased market, are there any plans to make a Dish 1000.4 compatible Trav'ler? If so, is there any chance that there will be an upgrade path (an upgrade kit to replace the reflector and LNB) for existing SK-1000 owners?

I just ordered an SK-1000, and it hasn't even arrived yet. Is there any hope that some day I will be able to make full use of it after my local market makes the migration? If there are no plans, please re-consider the market once the newest migrations are made.

[Winegard-JHoff]

Obviously this is something that we keep an eye on pretty closely. The main problem with a 1000.4 TRAV'LER is that it would only work in half of the country (the eastern arc signals are NOT available in the western half of the US). With the current SK-1000 (viewing 110, 119, 129), it is available nationwide, as eastern arc subscribers can view the western arc satellites.

And while it is true that with the western arc setup you'll be missing your local channels, your locals are being broadcast on "spot beams" and are only available when you are in your home market (DMA). When in your home market, you can put the TRAV'LER on Manual Mode and point at 1 (only 1 at a time) of the eastern arc satellites for your locals.

[ShapeShifter]

Thank you for your considered response, it's appreciated. I'm not surprised by your response, still I'm encouraged by your "watching it closely" comment.

I understand what you're saying. While it's true that my locals are spot-beamed, I'm the type of traveler that is gone almost every weekend, yet tends to spend 80% of my time within my spot beam. (Yes, I realize that's not typical, and that there are many different styles of travellers.) So I could make use of such a dish to get my locals, yet I understand that it won't be as important to others.

Also, while it's true that Eastern Arc users can still get a majority of their channels on a Western Arc dish (which is the reason I ordered the SK-1000 in the first place) there are some areas in the far northeast (New England) and in the far southern tips of Florida and Texas where reception of 129 is problematical because it's so low on the horizon. (Which was one reason for setting up an Eastern Arc in the first place.) So it's not necessarily safe to assume that the SK-1000 will be a final solution for all users in all places.

Finally, an Eastern Arc version could be appealing to those Eastern Arc users who move their receiver between their house and RV, and don't want to have to perform a check switch operation every time they move it. (Yes, I admit I'm clutching at straws here. )

I guess these last few comments are just to give some justifications to keep revisiting the marketing analysis from time to time. I understand the development and distribution expenses involved in coming out with a new product variation that would enjoy a limited market, especially when there is a viable alternative for most of the potential customers. Still, I'm encouranged by your attitude, and will check your product line from time to time to see if there are any new product announcements.

Thanks for your response! (This forum need a thumbs-up smiley!)

[pcardoza]

This response from Winegard shows a lack of knowledge and concern for RVers who are using their products! We east coasters who have Dish Network service, have a bear of a time getting a signal in many campgrounds, using the 119 western satellite locations! The Eastern Arc option is a godsend for many of us and having a SK1000 version for it would be an instant purchase for me!

Not to mention that my locals (Providence RI) are ONLY available on the 61.5 satellite! Right now, I'm struggling with the old single LNB crank-up dish on my RV, doing resets every time I need to switch satellites, between 61.5 and 72.5. A huge PITA.

Come on Winegard! Give us New Englanders a choice!

[ShapeShifter]

We east coasters who have Dish Network service, have a bear of a time getting a signal in many campgrounds, using the 119 western satellite locations!

A very good point about visibility. While it's technically possible to get 129 on the East coast, it is low on the horizon, and difficult to get unless in a wide-open space.

For example, where I am now in Western NY, 129 is at an elevation of 19.6 degrees, while the lowest of the Eastern Arc satellites is 61.5 at 37.4 degrees elevation. That 17.8 degrees difference may not sound like a lot, but it can easily mean the difference of getting a signal or not if there are trees or other obstructions around. Suppose that there is a 40 foot tall tree in the way: if that tree is 48 feet away, it will be no problem to get 61.5, but it would need to be 108 feet away to still be able to get 129 at the same location.

Move a little farther East to your town of Providence RI, and the elevation of 129 is only 15.1 degrees, which means that 40' tree would need to be 140 feet away to be able to see over it, while 61.5 would still be visible if that tree were as close as 46 feet. Finding 46 feet of clearance in a crowded campground is a lot easier than trying to find 140 feet of clear space!

Move farther up into New England and it only gets worse. At Bar Harbor in Maine, a popular tourist spot because of Acadia National Park, that same 40 foot tree needs to be 167 feet away to allow line of sight to 129, because it's only 11.9 degrees above the horizon.

Getting the Western satellites on the East coast requires a lot more open space, something that is often hard to find at a campground.

The Eastern Arc option is a godsend for many of us and having a SK1000 version for it would be an instant purchase for me!

I also would get it without blinking. Since I've installed that dish on the roof, on average, it only works about 50% of the time because there are trees in the way blocking 129. I can watch it get 110 and 119, but nothing on 129, so it re-tries a few times, and then finally gives up and stows. If I run into problems that often, I'm sure you run into them even more.

If it were looking for the Eastern Arc birds it would have a much easier time finding them around here. Then, not only would I be able to get my 61.5 locals when I'm close enough to home (which is most of the time) but I wouldn't be stuck pulling out the portable dish when the tree line is too close. (And I wouldn't have to keep performing a check switch every time I switched between the SK-1000, my portable dish, and my home dish.)

And after working out these numbers, it got me thinking about something said in the original reply:

The main problem with a 1000.4 TRAV'LER is that it would only work in half of the country (the eastern arc signals are NOT available in the western half of the US).

Actually, this sounds like an argument FOR having a 1000.4 version, not against. If this were true, then it could be said that the West coast signals are NOT available in the Eastern half of the US. Doing the same math for a 1000.4 on the West coast that I just did for a 1000.2 on the East coast, you end up with very similar results. Place a 1000.4 in Los Angeles, and the the lowest Eastern Arc satellite is 61.5 at an elevation of 18.9 degrees. That's close to what I get with 129, and significantly better than pcardoza gets in Providence. If, as you say, the 1000.2 is a satisfactory solution for us on the East coast, then the 1000.4 is just as satisfactory on the West coast, and the argument holds no water.

Admittedly, on the West coast a 1000.4 won't work as well as a 1000.2, and people who spend most of their time in the Western half of the country should use a 1000.2 to get the best signal. If I were to have a 1000.4, and I visited California, I would have more line of sight issues than I would with a 1000.2. But those issues I would experience on a theoretical trip out West are the same issues I experience on every trip I take with the current equipment. Dish Network realizes that there is an issue for their East Coast customers, and has come up with a solution. It sure would be nice if Winegard allowed us to take advantage of it.

There are two options for DirecTV customers, but only one for Dish Network customers. The SK-3005 does everything that the SK-3003 does, and more. Wouldn't everybody be served by an SK-3005? Why is there still the option for the SK-3003?

I hope Winegard does indeed keep re-evaluating this issue.

[phs340]

Have a move in view on an Rv living and travlling up and down theeast coast its no pleaseure getting signal for dish network receivers and its a pain to keep havingto check switch and reprogram.

It there goingto be a better mouse trap worth purchasing for future use?

[phs340]

Have a move in view mv-0099 on an Rv living and travlling up and down the east coast and its been no pleasure getting signal for dish network receivers and its a pain to keep havingto check switch and reprogram.

It there goingto be a better mouse trap worth purchasing for future use or parts available to update to receive new satelights with hd signal??

[dbonney]

Winegards quote: "When in your home market, you can put the TRAV'LER on Manual Mode and point at 1 (only 1 at a time) of the eastern arc satellites for your locals.Winegard-JHoff"

Sounds good except the software, in manual mode, does not let you choose or lock into satellite 77, which is where our local HD channels are. If this has changed, and we can upgrade our software let me know.